[racket] syntax, differently

From: Richard Cleis (rcleis at mac.com)
Date: Sat Jul 31 16:44:09 EDT 2010

I think we are talking about several things, here.

One of them is about reformatting the whole file and another is  
reformatting locally when the programmer is approaching a line length  
of 80.

I program with full trust in the Dr's ability to auto-indent and check- 
syntax, so I do both constantly.  That way, I am never surprised by a  
big change in the file.  Nearly the same result could almost be  
achieved by live auto formatting of only the definition undergoing  
editting.  ('almost', because there are ghosts to haunt anyone who  
attempts such an implementation).  I would have attempted this awhile  
ago if I knew how to get started.

The line-length issue is one that could partly be handled by allowing  
the programmer to size the editting window  to exactly the correct  
length, then manually edit to eliminate wrappings. However, I wouldn't  
mind if the Dr took the scapel and tried to fix it for me.


On Jul 31, 2010, at 1:42 PM, Jos Koot <jos.koot at telefonica.net> wrote:

> I am not a student, but try to think and do like student now.
> I would be very frustrated when all the time I run a program, my  
> code would
> be reindented and get quite another appearance. WHAT HAPPENS HERE,  
> would be
> my first thought. Reindenting a file before saving it would give me  
> the same
> surprise when opening it again. Wow, this apparently is not the  
> program I
> have entered. Where is my program???
> Nevertheless I agree with Matthias that indentation is a very  
> helpfull tool.
> But doing that without explicit request seems confusing to me (at  
> the least)
> Just a strong advice to type control-I from time to time would not be
> adaquate? Furthermore, typing a program with the standard indentation
> settings already gives indentation while typing. Wow, that's not the
> indentation I expected after my last line-break. Ho, I see, a  
> parenthesis
> too much or too less in the previous line. No problem, add or remove  
> it
> followed by control-I.
> BTW, for myself I prefer indentation by exactly as many spaces as  
> there are
> unsatisfied open parentheses (for as far as possible, for shotcuts  
> like '''
> and '#'' and '#,@' may inhibit my preferred indentation.)
> Jos
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: users-bounces at racket-lang.org
>> [mailto:users-bounces at racket-lang.org] On Behalf Of Matthias  
>> Felleisen
>> Sent: 31 July 2010 21:14
>> To: Robby Findler
>> Cc: Eli Barzilay; racket List
>> Subject: Re: [racket] syntax, differently
>> The file wouldn't move all the time. It would move on RUN and
>> on SAVE.
>> Most experienced programmers wouldn't see any movement whatsoever.
>> Students would see movement for a short time. Then they'd
>> follow the flow.
>> -- Matthias
>> On Jul 31, 2010, at 2:25 PM, Robby Findler wrote:
>>> Thinking as someone who would be implementing these changes, I can
>>> easily see a whole slew of bug reports coming in of the
>> form "When I
>>> save my file DrRacket moves all the lines around. What's
>> going on?!".
>>> So, while I agree that there is something to be done here vis a vis
>>> indentation help in the PDE, I don't think we quite are at
>> the "try to
>>> implement it and play with it" stage yet.
>>> Robby
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